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Author Topic: Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working  (Read 25907 times)

Offline Parkerman

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2012, 08:45:08 AM »
Well maybe some of us want to retain the original stock board, who knows, who gives a S**T I am only offering help to those that want it, if you don't need it then fine [:p] as I have already said if you had bothered to read this thread [:D] "you pays your money and you takes your choice" it's only a frigging mod, don't get so steamed up fella...........stay [8D]

I am going to offer Alex my humble appologies here, I just get a little hot under the collar after spending most of last night and a few more hours today to then learn that someone is suggesting "I don't get it !! why do you need it" so Alex I am sorry for leaping off but I am only trying to offer a simple mod here for all to see, and as I said it may not be for everyone, I would like to learn more of the Fishman Powerchip though, and I have seen your excellent thread swapping out Rev1 for Rev2 pups, some nice work there, again apologies for my outburst [:I] [:X]

PMan
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 12:22:13 PM by Parkerman »
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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Tectonix

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2012, 10:25:11 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by Parkerman

OK so let's just look at straight passive HB's for now and then maybe we will do a switched version, yes like the idea of a Rocker on the back-plate Casey, although I would suggest a Slide switch, this was going to be one of my suggestions, or possibly mounted into the battery cover plate?



Parkerman, do you think you will be venturing forth on a switched version soon? I always like to have the most choices possible and this seems like a great tonal addition. [;)]

I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 10:26:20 AM by Tectonix »
I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline lucgravely

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2012, 10:27:55 AM »
I see advantages of both. I love the idea of modding the old board. I love the idea of PTP wiring. Now to just make up my mind which to do... I'll probably side with the "money" and remove my old wiring completely intact and sell it.

In general though Parkerman I love your thinking outside the "box" on this one.
Luc Gravely
Parker Fly Mojo Singlecut
Parker NiteFly NV1
Mesa/Boogie Mark I
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A few pedals...

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2012, 11:25:25 AM »
To make the switched version would take a little more time to look over the circuit more carefully, it is not a simple task it now appears, personally I agree with you Luc and would like the complete tonal range but sometimes we all have to make decisions, if it is possible I should know in the next 48 hours or so, but I need to get down with the circuit and figure this one out, so in a nutshell maybe more to follow.......watch this space !!!!

PMan
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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2012, 05:17:13 PM »
quote:
Originally posted by Tectonix

quote:
Originally posted by Parkerman

OK so let's just look at straight passive HB's for now and then maybe we will do a switched version, yes like the idea of a Rocker on the back-plate Casey, although I would suggest a Slide switch, this was going to be one of my suggestions, or possibly mounted into the battery cover plate?



Parkerman, do you think you will be venturing forth on a switched version soon? I always like to have the most choices possible and this seems like a great tonal addition. [;)]

I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!



I have spent a couple of hours looking at this and the best I can achieve would be to use a 4 pole double thro mini toggle switch,unfortunately it needs to be like this as it would need to switch all the components in and out of circuit. These switches are available but are quite cumbersome as they have 12 solder tags on them and a body measuring around 20 x 15 x 12mm, so where would it be located, I don't want to drill holes in my baby, well not the body [:(] so any suggestions, what about the battery compartment cover ??

EDIT: Just found the perfect 4 pole switch on e-bay # 390390161084

PMan
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 06:43:45 PM by Parkerman »
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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Tectonix

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2012, 09:17:44 PM »
Pman---Something was just haunting me about this whole topic line all day. Checked your Bio. Amp Repair!!! In my opinion, what is so refreshing about your technique is that you have approached the problem  from an amp mod angle instead of a guitar tech angle. Amp mod guys I have been exposed to do not gut-and-go. They completely figure out the unit and then repair or mod or add from there. It looks to me like that was your approach.

I befriended a professional amp repair guy here in SoCal and it looks like both of you travel the same track. Whether I am accurate about that or not, still, you have done a Fabulous Job! [^]

By the by, can a slide switch work according to your very last post? [:)]

I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!
« Last Edit: March 09, 2012, 09:19:38 PM by Tectonix »
I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline billy

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2012, 09:28:30 PM »
Awesome, thanks much!

Do the master volume and stereo/mono work now, or does the mod bypass these?

I like it because it's reversible and takes advantage of parts I already have.  The flex and pcb, though a little flawed in execution, are just a few more things that are unique to the flys.  Plus this kind of rework is pretty easy for me, SMD is not hard with a little know how.

If I had flexes or a pcb that was failing, I'd probably consider p2p depending on my mood, $$, and free time.
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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« Reply #22 on: March 10, 2012, 06:38:51 AM »
Well Tectonix a quick brief, I work in research and development for a very well known UK company that manufactures pro-studio recording/processor gear, my approach is simply sit and study the original circuit in hand before turning on the soldering iron, nothing more, nothing less, I also try to foresee any issues that may be encountered from a mechanical aspect too, so yes I guess this is me, the amp repair stuff and guitar re-work/set-ups is simply a pastime/hobby of mine being a keen vintage guitar and valve amp collector.....

Yes the slide switch I have posted from e-bay is ideal with respect to the number of poles and switch functions, the only issue is that this switch is a PCB mount and does not have any fixing tabs for securing to a chassis or plate, but this could be worked around I am sure.

Billy the mono mode only works for the passive HB's sadly with no Piezo, however use a stereo cable and a 2 channel amp and you have both Piezo and HB with full mixing control, the Master Level only controls the Piezo level (which I find a bonus to be honest) along with the normal stock Piezo split Volume/Tone pot, the passive HB volume is controlled by the normal HB Volume Pot and Tone Pot, so in Stereo mode you have every mixing facility of Piezo Volume and Tone and HB Volume and Tone, however the toggle selector switch for HB/Both/Piezo works as follows: HB is HB only, Both is both pick-ups, and Piezo is also both Pick-ups, this is just because of the way the electronics are organized in the original design so nothing I can do about it...... yet !!! The good news is that the HB selector toggle works as original stock Neck/Both(single coil)/Bridge, so the only issue is getting the mono function working correctly, although this may not be possible with the Passive HB's...........more to do I guess[:)]

Thank you for the encouraging comments guys [;)]

PMan
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 06:57:40 AM by Parkerman »
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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Paul Marossy

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2012, 08:15:14 AM »
Just for the record, there is a schematic for the original (pre-refined) Fly on the web. http://jmstaehli.com/images/guitars/Parker%20Fly%20Schematic.pdf

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline sybersitizen

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« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2012, 08:37:58 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by Parkerman

... the only issue is getting the mono function working correctly, although this may not be possible with the Passive HB's...

I think that was the exact reason why the design involved running the humbuckers through the preamp along with the piezos.

'01 Fly Deluxe|'69 SG Standard
'01 Fly Deluxe|'69 SG Standard|'69 EB-3|Pignose Strat|Savannah SGO-16CE|Fishman Aura Spectrum|Roland Amplifiers

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2012, 11:44:30 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by Paul Marossy

Just for the record, there is a schematic for the original (pre-refined) Fly on the web. http://jmstaehli.com/images/guitars/Parker%20Fly%20Schematic.pdf
__/\\/\\__PJM__/\\/\\__
http://www.DIYguitarist.com
http://www.myspace.com/j201jams



Hi Paul, yep that is the one I have been using........thanks anyway[:)]

Sybersitizen well yes that is most likely the case and it would make sense to use this arrangement but it does result in the HB's sounding very bright and typically active, which indeed they are as a stock Fly. Like all things I am sure there is another way to skin the rabbit, it is just a matter of working it through and finding the solution. [:(]

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2012, 02:56:27 PM »
Guys I have now had this passive HB mod in place for around 36 hours and have been playing my cherrished Fly almost constantly, I am no great axe grinder but I can bang out a descent enough tune in Blues and Rock scales and trust me when I say, if ever the world was to allow me just one guitar (and I have around 17 electrics) it would be my modified Fly, whereas 2 days ago I would have needed 2 guitars to fullfill my desire, one of my 70's Ibanez Artists and of course the Fly, but now I have the Artist and Fly in one lightweight package and the best action in the world, what more can a humble guitarist need........[;)]

Seriously though, if this mod doesn't float your boat then I suspect nothing ever will, the pallete of tones when using the stereo output is quite exceptional, from the Strat like tones with both Buckers in sigle coil mode to the bluesy slightly overdriven neck HB, and when cleaned up a little pure jazz.........sweet [:)] the bridge pup now has depth, balls, punch and grunt but can cut through for searing solos and rock riffs when overdriven, and for country rock, combine the warmth of the passive neck HB and mix in the bite and zing of the Piezo and the thing just sings, I love it.

This guitar is now a Swiss Army Knife, it has everything packed into one tiny body and just begs never to be put down. I set out to simply  make an already superb instrument into something with that extra wow factor, and now I believe it has this in droves. I think if I can squeeze into the mix the original active HB's via a small concealed slide switch
then every possible tone would be there at your fingertips.....

I am not suggesting this mod will be for everyone, who knows, but for the small initial outlay and the fact that every mod can be reversed it has to be worth a shot for some of you, just try it......
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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Tectonix

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« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2012, 08:33:17 PM »
quote:
Originally posted by Parkerman
I am not suggesting this mod will be for everyone, who knows, but for the small initial outlay and the fact that every mod can be reversed it has to be worth a shot for some of you, just try it......



You've really done a lot of work on this and, speaking for myself, I'm over the moon on it. In time, I will venture forth on this with the slide switch option. I will keep watching this topic for it, but just have to say you have really been so generous with your knowledge and I am sure there will be a few who venture forth on the trail you've set. Thanks a Million![:D]

I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!
« Last Edit: March 10, 2012, 08:33:40 PM by Tectonix »
I started out in life with nothing and still have most of it left!

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Voice Of Reason

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« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2012, 12:54:33 AM »
Being able to "de-activate" the magnetic pups is exactly what I'm looking for... now, the question remains... who has reviews and/or sound clips of the tone change?

I'd definitely would look into it (with the PTP and new chip conversion), but I'd need to be sure before undergoing this - qualified Parker techs are rare in my neck of woods...and I'm in Toronto!

1998 Fly Classic (my only Parker)

Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working

Offline Parkerman

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Active to Passive HB's on a Fly now working
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2012, 07:07:11 AM »
Guys one simple question.....as I am a newbie here and a relative newbie Fly owner would making these mods to my cherished 2002 Fly Deluxe have an adverse effect on the re-sale value, if (heaven forbid) I ever needed to sell it ? I would appreciate some feedback here as I have no idea, I do have a collection of vintage Ibanez Artists and if I were ever to think of drilling holes in the bodies of any of these it would certainly devalue these instruments, so do we have the same deal with a Pre-Refined Fly ???

OK, here we go.......

Cleaning up the cavity area for a switch to be installed !!!!

OK I have looked at the various options for installing a switch and here they are:

1/ Drill a hole in top of body and fit a 4 pole 2 way Mini-Toggle switch. (Obtrusive)

2/ Remove the battery and relocate to under the pre-amp PCB and place Mini-Toggle switch into battery cavity. (Less obtrusive)

3/ Fix a 4 pole 2 way Slide switch (as indicated in an earlier post) to the underside of the plactic cavity cover. (Non obtrusive)

Here are some images of the cavity space cleaned up after redressing the HB wires and the real estate that is available for either the battery or Mini-Toggle switch and another of the battery sat snuggly in this area, both are possible options, both have their pro's and con's, the slide switch option 3 is the least obtrusive but the switches I have found do not have a fixing tab for a screw to secure to the cavity cover so would need to be glued in place, unless some of you guys know of an altrenative 4 pole 2 way Slide switch, if so please let me know, anyway here are the images pf the cavity area after cleaning up the wiring from the HB's with a few plastic Ty-Raps......



and with the battery relocated and yes the pre-amp PCB still has enough space with the battery installed here, this would make use of the battery cavity for the Mini-Toggle switch....



And with a Mini-Toggle switch in place in the battery compartment:



And this is to show how much the toggle will protrude from the guitar body edge, it is a winner I believe [:D]



it is a very good fit, I could not have wished for a better solution to be truthful, I believe this would be my personal recommendation, the Mini-Toggle is easily accessable, the mod is easier to do, the wires from the switch can be routed through the hole provided for the battery leads, it all makes perfect sense to me and the Mini-Toggle switches are available here:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-Pole-DT-2-position-Toggle-switch-NEW-/120841505022?pt=UK_Trains_Railway_Models&hash=item1c22b708fe

and the battery cover is surely still available from Parker should you wish to restore to orginal stock flavor any time in the future, this one certainly gets my vote guys....

What do you think ??????

PMan
« Last Edit: March 11, 2012, 07:45:37 AM by Parkerman »
Don't wait for it to happen !