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Author Topic: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles  (Read 2733 times)

Offline Ron

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Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« on: September 15, 2016, 08:53:04 PM »
I need some help finalizing my plans rewiring my 1996 Parker Fly Deluxe with Carvin Holdsworth H22 humbuckers similar to the Carvin DC127 guitar with coil splitting:
http://www.carvinmuseum.com/pdf/guitarbass/passivekit20-50guitarwiring.pdf

Because limited space for control hardware I would like to place the two mini-switches on one rotary selector switch with three positions: 

Position 1 [front]: neck pickup coil A together with bridge pickup coil B (for the Telecaster sound)

Position 2 [middle]: mag humbucker circuit (no mods) controlled by 3-way toggle

Position 3 [back]: neck pickup coil B and bridge pickup coil A together (for the Strat sound)

I am unsure of the required specs for the rotary switch.  Do I need a 4 pole 3 position switch?  How should it be wired?

Let me know if you need any other information.  Thanks so much for your response.   Ron Free
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline marcwormjim

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2016, 09:56:36 PM »
Sorry to be that guy, but your post doesn't mention how you're going to fit non-Fly pickups into a Fly. It's just that that's the biggest hurdle in this idea to sort out before addressing the control circuit.

Edit: You can achieve that switching without mini-toggles or a rotary by just wiring push-pull or push-push pots for volume and tone, with each one sending the A of one coil and the B of another to ground. Unless, of course, you're wanting the option to combine a humbucker and single-coil, too.

Additionally, do you intend to have the guitar rewired point-to-point with a Power Chip for the piezo, or are you trying to retain the original ribbon assembly, as well?
« Last Edit: September 15, 2016, 10:05:57 PM by marcwormjim »
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2016, 02:37:32 PM »
Sorry to leave out some important details. I was trying to be brief.  The Carvin pickups were already installed when I bought the Fly--ribbon assembly removed.  Also, I recently installed a GraphTech Acousti-Phonic.

Five holes will be filled as follows: with Mag Master Volume, Mag Master Tone, standard 3-way toggle Mag Selector, Acousti-Phonic 3-way (mags/both/acoustic) mini-toggle, and Acousti-Phonic Volume stacked with a push-pull Mid/Dark tone switch.  In the sixth remaining hole I plan to put a 3-way rotary switch combining the two coil split circuits with the existing humbucker circuit.

I know rotary switches are rarely used on a guitar but thought it would be the most practical use of the remaining hole.  I prefer that over push-pull or push-push on the volume & tone pots.

The Carvin 4-Wire Humbucker Color Codes are:
North Start (RED) North Finish (white) > Hot
South Finish (Green) South Start (Black) > Ground Wiring shown for Slug pole coil is South magnetic polarity and screw pole coil is North magnetic polarity.
 Slug pole coil is South magnetic polarity and screw pole coil is North magnetic polarity.

Many thanks for you input!

PS: I have diagrams and a photo but haven't been able to figure out how to attach or embed them.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2016, 03:10:37 PM by Ron »
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline billy

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2016, 11:05:49 AM »
Sounds cool. One thing to consider is that rotary switches have a relatively high torque. Hard to keep it anchored properly in the wood. Think about how often volume and tone knobs become loose and they are easier to turn by far. If you can find an internal star lock washer for the inside, it will help a lot.
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2016, 08:26:00 PM »
Thanks Billy!  That's something I didn't think about.  I will certainly try to do that. :)
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2016, 02:09:48 PM »
I have ordered a 4 pole 3 position switch to incorporate the Humbucker circuit and two single coil combinations.

Now I need to transfer the switching matrix from the two mini-toggle switches in this diagram to the rotary switch:

Here is a diagram of the rotary switch specs:

I am having trouble seeing how to transfer the layout of the circuits in the Carvin wiring diagram to the rotary switch.  It’s almost like learning another language.  Maybe it’s because I am a very right-brained musician.

Could one of you left-brainers please draw me a diagram?
« Last Edit: September 30, 2016, 02:16:40 PM by Ron »
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2016, 02:15:04 PM »
I see my inserted images are not showing up. >:(  If someone will help me with this please send me your e-mail address and I will send the diagrams...OR...You may see them at my post on:http://kieselguitarsbbs.com/viewtopic.php?p=618691#618691
« Last Edit: October 03, 2016, 04:39:08 PM by Ron »
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline resettheconsole

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2016, 03:03:45 PM »
How are those pickups mounted?

Likely using mounting rings, but is there really eniough meat under the neck pickup for the height adjustment screws? Very curious to know.

If you want to email me the pictures, I can get them to load on the forum for you. You should be able to send an email directly to me through the forum. If not, PM me and I'll give you my email address.

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2016, 05:13:28 PM »
Thanks Reset,

I don't know how they are mounted.  When I bought it they were already installed.  This linked shows a routing template for the Carvin 22 series on page 2: http://www.carvinmuseum.com/pdf/guitarbass/passivekit20-50guitarwiring.pdf

I was able to post my diagrams on: http://kieselguitarsbbs.com/viewtopic.php?p=618691#618691

Greatly appreciate your help, Ron
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline billy

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2016, 11:11:33 AM »
I didn't look too close to see if this is the configuration you want, but there are rotary guitar wiring diagrams online already.

http://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Online_Resources/Learn_About_Guitar_Pickups_and_Electronics_and_Wiring/Wiring_Kit_for_Paul_Reed_Smith.html

Might need to do searching but they are there, good luck!
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline Ron

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2016, 04:56:04 PM »
Thanks Billy!

I have been doing searches online but so far have not seen a configuration like mine.  The link you shared is for a five-way rotary switch.  My 3-way is simpler and I'm puzzled why a diagram isn't readily available.

I'll keep looking. 8) Ron
 

Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles

Offline billy

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Re: Substituting rotary pickup selector switch for two toggles
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2016, 08:29:31 PM »
Here's a good explanation of how the switch contacts are organized. Half the battle.

http://www.harmonycentral.com/forum/forum/guitar/acapella-41/1103634-

Your switch might be different but the same idea should apply. i.e. The inside pins each connect to a group of outside pins.
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Posting For OP, Ron

Offline resettheconsole

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Posting For OP, Ron
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2016, 12:41:39 PM »
From an email from Ron:

I have a modified 1996 Parker Fly Deluxe with Carvin Holdsworth H22 humbuckers &  GraphTech Acousti-Phonic piezos.  I wish to rewire the humbuckers similar to the Carvin DC127 guitar with coil splitting:
 
   

Only problem is that I have run out of pot & switch holes and don’t really have room for another.  Five holes will be filled with Mag Master Volume, Mag Master Tone, standard 3-way Mag Selector, Acousti-Phonic 3-way (mags/both/acoustic) mini-toggle, and Acousti-Phonic Volume stacked with a push-pull Mid/Dark tone switch.  In the sixth remaining hole I plan is to put a 3-way rotary switch combining the two coil split arrangements with the standard humbucker selector.

     

It would work like this:

Position 1 [front]: neck pickup coil A together with bridge pickup coil B (for the Telecaster sound)

Position 2 [middle]: standard mag humbucker circuit (no mods)

Position 3 [back]: neck pickup coil B and bridge pickup coil A together (for the Strat sound)

I think a rotary selector will be more distinct than a 3-way toggle thus avoiding confusion with the mag and Acoustic-phonic toggle selectors.

I have ordered a 4 pole 3 position switch to incorporate the Humbucker circuit and two single coil combinations.  Now I need to transfer the switching matrix from the two mini-toggle switches in the Carvin DC127 wiring diagram to the rotary switch.

Here is a diagram of the rotary switch specs:
   


I am having trouble seeing how to transfer the layout of the circuits in the Carvin wiring diagram to the rotary switch.  Maybe it’s because I am a very right-brained musician.

Could one of you left-brainers please draw me a diagram?

Carvin 4-Wire Humbucker Color Codes. Wiring shown for standard humbucking mode (series/in-phase). Slug pole coil is South magnetic polarity and screw pole coil is North magnetic polarity.


     

Additional Carvin Pickup Wiring Instructions:
http://www.carvinmuseum.com/pdf/guitarbass/passivekit20-50guitarwiring.pdf