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Author Topic: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)  (Read 219 times)

Offline djlest

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Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« on: November 12, 2017, 08:43:54 AM »
Hello
 i picked up a Parker P60 with a few issues (broken tremelo bush) or so i was hoping that was the only issue.

After fixing the Tremelo and using it briefly the bridge posts shifted and popped the back plastic plate off.
I stripped down the bridge posts and found that the adjustment screws had their heads stripped, so i removed them and purchased a brand new set of adjustment screws hoping this would enable me to keep the bridge posts firmy adjusted and set up, wrong!

Unfortunately after putting everything back together the Bridge posts still protrude and pop my back plate off.
I am quite certain that i have the screws in correctly and bridge post and parts all seem to be tightened and sitting flush.
I know i need the extra SPACING otherwise the trem would not have any room to move, but surely the bridge nuts should be tighter or stay put in the guitar body?
Im wondering if im missing some C clips or some spacers or something?
although i dont think anything is missing.
Im baffled to be honest!

does anyone have any ideas or experience with the P series or has knowledge from stripping one down?

I was hoping with string tension and springs it would stay put but after a few drives it pushed the post about 1/8 inch backwards again and pushes the backplate out.

Does anyone have a diagram of the parts for the P60 trem setup?
i will try to attach some pics to help explain a little better

Thanks folks

Link to pics
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4tHLsTz_LMKLWFoV3dZa0x2MWhCUVNvRzJ4SDBtVkVkc053/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4tHLsTz_LMKVU11VXVqYnRNZy1JQzRKcVlsZ3N1WnlWempz/view?usp=sharing
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 08:46:17 AM by djlest »

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline jb63

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2017, 10:57:33 AM »
It LOOKS like everything is correct. I haven't taken one apart in a while but its on my list of things to do.
Is it possible that the posts just aren't tight and have stripped the wood?
Do they fit in tight before you put the bridge on?

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline djlest

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2017, 03:27:02 AM »
Hello thanks for replying

the posts are not tight no, they slide in and out of the circular bored holes quite easily.
They have a few indentations on them which to me looks like perhaps a C clip should belong there, or perhaps something else to keep them locked into the wood?

Either way i think even if the wooden bore holes were tight, because of the space between the tremelo and the upper body, a couple of hard dive bombs or expressive playing would still work the whole bridge and trem backwards. surely there must be a spacer or something else to prevent this?

Perhaps a diagram to see if i'm missing parts if anyone has one?

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline jb63

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2017, 11:31:35 AM »
Unfortunately, I've NEVER seen a take-apart diagram, even here in the forums, of the bridge.
I have a lot of pieces and a body that I'd like to put together, but haven't found the time yet.
The whole mess is even at a luthier right now, but he hasn't found the time either.

I guess its just a wealth of too many guitars!

You could always buy a cheap, returnable one:

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Used/Parker-Guitars/PDF60-Solid-Body-Electric-Guitar-113617842.gc

(that's about as cheap as they get!)

and dismantle it carefully and then compare to yours, then put it all back together (after taking all the pictures!) and return it. That's what I would do in your situation!


Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline billy

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2017, 03:08:28 PM »
If the bushings are sliding in the wood, that’s one issue but not too hard to fix.

If the posts are sliding in the bushings, that’s a different issue but also easy to fix.

You might have both issues but hard to know from your messages.

I have some pictures that are similar in a document I posted about fixing forward leaning bridges. If you search it should show up.

The main difference is the bushing style. The fly uses c clips to retain the post screws, and the bushing you have uses “grub” screws (double sided screws with a hex slot).

Think about what is sliding and let us know, and we can help you get it sorted.
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline djlest

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2017, 04:56:15 PM »
Hi Billy thanks for the reply
i will attach a link to a pic to hopefully show you what i mean

I purchased a brand new set of grub screws because the old ones had the hex part rounded by its previous owner. so definitely some abuse has been given to this area of the guitar.

However its the large bored bridge posts that are slipping when the trem is pushed down it causes the whole bridge to move inwards and the large posts protrude out the back.
(see pic of protruding posts)

The grub screws only alter the height of the bridge but dont do anything to keep the larger posts fixed or locked to the body. The large posts have a lip that stop it going forwards locking it on one side, but on the front side of the guitar the smaller posts that connect to the actual bridge are free floating. nothing locks to the body on the front side it seems.

At first i thought the grub screws that connect to both the large bridge post and the smaller posts had too much space, but it is definitely not an issue with them.

I was toying with the idea of gluing the metal posts to the guitar body, im not sure if that would work. I did also read the document about forward leaning bridges although my bridge is not leaning. i dont think i have the clearance for a washer around the large bridge posts.

I know the nitefly series has completely different bridge posts with a C clip, but the P series doesn't seem to.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4tHLsTz_LMKLWFoV3dZa0x2MWhCUVNvRzJ4SDBtVkVkc053/view
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 05:00:52 PM by djlest »

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline billy

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2017, 08:55:25 PM »
Those are the bushings. What’s weird is that the black coating is scraped off the edges. So either someone filed them down, or they had them in and out so many times there’s no longer a good friction fit to the wood.

What I would do is get some cheap flat toothpicks (not round) and glue 4-5 of them inside the hole, evenly spaced around the circumference, so that the toothpicks are relatively parallel to the axis of the hole. Use the pointier side towards the rear.

You can use wood glue or even white glue. Then you’ll need to carefully put the bushings back in, with some light hammering or an arbor press. (A drill press can work too if you don’t turn it on. Lol)   Be sure to stop just before the bushing hits bottom- or it can damage the face of the guitar.

Make sure you don’t use too many toothpicks or it will be too hard to press in, and you risk damaging the body.

Let it dry for a day and then check.

Fwiw The best way to do this repair would be to fill the hole with a wood plug or dowel cut to flush and glue, then redrill the holes.

But in this case, adding some wood “shims” should work well enough once the glue dries. If not, you haven’t lost much and can still fill and redrill.
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline djlest

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2017, 02:17:15 AM »
Thanks Billy
yes the black paint looks like someone went at it with some mole grips or something to remove them, no idea why.
Im a bit suprised that parker didnt design the bushings to be more secure or to perhaps have some  locking mechanism, i find it difficult to imagine these bushing are just supposed to stay secure there based on a tight fit when they are directly affected by the pressures and hard forces of a whammy bar. i still feel there has to be something missing, surely they dont just hammer them in and thats it it, they stay put. What about humidity and wood shrinkage or expansion?

Anyway as a last resort i will try wood glue and tooth picks and try hammering them gently in with a rubber mallet. although i was hoping this wasn't the only solution. there is no way i want to redrill the holes as they are really big about 1 inch diameter. Another thing i noticed is one of the bushings never fitted flush in the hole, almost as if the bored holes were not done straight in the factory. That and a lot of paint residue left behind in on the upper lip.

Cant say the Indonesian made Parkers have impressed me so far, its a shame really because the body was beautifully light and the action was still better than most. Even for a cheap guitar i love it.

Thanks for your valuable input, i appreciate it.
And if anyone else has a P series please let me know if they have removed the bridge before?

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline billy

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2017, 04:44:23 PM »
Crazy as it sounds, the friction works quite well in most cases to retain the bushings in the wood. 

It seems like someone had a simpler problem they didn't know how to resolve and distorted the hole.  Whoever took out the bushings didn't seem to have enough sense to tap them out from the front and probably manhandled them with screwdrivers and vice grips.  They may have pushed the hole off axis a bit too.  Or perhaps the hole was initially off axis, as you suggest, and this is what caused them to remove the bushings to begin with.

The filling and drilling isn't too bad if you have a drill press and the right diameter forstner bit (drills a flat bottom hole in larger diameters). 

The toothpicks do seem a little kludgey but it is cheap, easy, reversible, and requires almost no tools.  I believe it will be very effective since you can space them around the circumference without screwing up the hole center too drastically.  Just don't go crazy with the glue.  If there's paint inside the entire hole, substitute super glue for wood glue.

Good luck!
Billy

[always the beautiful answer who asks a more beautiful question.  e. e. cummings]

Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)

Offline gaustu

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Re: Parker P Bridge Trem Issue (pushing Back Plate Off)
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2017, 03:12:46 AM »
Hi

I had recent problems with forward leaning bridge of my PDF85 and fixed it in my own way. But didn't read this forum threads before.
I see you have no leaning issue but it is concerned about bushing holes. So I just share my little experience too.
I had to take out one bushing only - against the bass side of bridge, because the leaning happened with that side only.
I pulled it out with no big force. then I scoured inside one side of bushing hole a bit - about 1 mm - toward the back of guitar - all the way deal inside. Now my hole became like an oval (the longer axis of oval was co-directional of the guitar's axis).
Before pushing bushing inside, I inserted a rectangle piece of thin plastic 1 mm tape all the depth long and around 1 diameter wide - to the front side of hole between the wood and bushing. It was much harder to insert it inside then pull outside before... I used the heavy hummer that time. The leaning issue was gone away neatly! Everything turned to be very perfect and strong.

You can use different stuff inside to increase the friction for bushings inside holes. but I guess it would be better if the square of adjoined surfaces would be as bigger as possible.