Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length

Author Topic: Essential Solos  (Read 11315 times)

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #75 on: September 18, 2006, 11:09:05 AM »
yeah, i always found that learning to play a favourite song always took some of the magic out of it.
deep appreciation for technical ability?  this only inspires jealousy in me!! (the good sort that makes you want to practice harder)
It's the originality of what i am musically hearing (original to my ears at least) that provides the apprecciation and love.  The fact that few can muster the technical ability is what makes the music/lick/riff original and exciting.

before people reply telling me i don't know the difference in what i am hearing, i do.

A jet engine doesn't impress me.  doing 750mph on a dry lake bed doesn't really impress me either.  Knowing that Thrust SSC was the first to break the sound barrier on land DOES.  so it's not the technical ability, bhp, mph or power of the car that impresses me, but the overall end result.

One arm pull ups don't impress me (much!).  Using those muscles to Free-Climb a craggy rock face does.

knowhatimean?
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #76 on: September 18, 2006, 11:11:59 AM »
i guess i am trying to say that when a virtuoso does something dazzling and i cheer, am i cheering the ability or the resulting music?  how can anyone else make assumptions about me and make that decision on my behalf?

hmm, this is interesting!!  i must have more conversations with myself on forums.
feel free to chip in folks!!
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline Lwinn171

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1860
Essential Solos
« Reply #77 on: September 18, 2006, 02:22:08 PM »
I tend to judge guitar solo's by two criteria: What the guitarist puts into it, and what he or she leaves out. The rests are every bit as valid as the flourishes, and in fact, serve to define them. A lack of notes can create space to contrast the superfluosity that follows. Balance and structure, choice of notes, touch and feel, and technical skill are all important.

Lawrence Winn
"42.7 percent of all statistics are made-up on the spot."
2001 Fly Classic, Green
Larivee Parlour Guitar
Several inferior others
Mesa Boogie MK IV
Marshall 2-12 cab

Lawrence Winn
2001 Classic, 98 Deluxe
various amps, various toys

Essential Solos

Offline uburoibob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3262
    • Bob Martin 11:11
Essential Solos
« Reply #78 on: September 18, 2006, 11:29:33 PM »
Whether or not the solo is at the speed of light, or the speed of molasses, I agree with Lawrence.

I think that if it's well constructed, suits the song, respects the melody, holds melodic interest, doesn't rely nearly 100% on arpeggios, scales or riffs, and has some sort of stress and release mechanism in the overall figure and the the individual passages, then a solo is great. I ask only one request - can someone show me any guitar player that can pull that off at the speed of light (except maybe one or two of the jazz cats in history)?

Bob

2000 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail  *  1999 Parker Fly Deluxe w/DiBurro Roland Mod Metallic Red  * 1998 Fly Classic in Transparent Dark Blue (thanks, Darren!) •  Now on a signature reduction program! Just the Flies, maam. *  www.rtmadvertising.com
« Last Edit: September 18, 2006, 11:30:20 PM by uburoibob »
1999 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail Butterscotch -   2000 Fly Standard Classic in Cherry Red - http://bobmartin1111.com

Essential Solos

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #79 on: September 19, 2006, 11:19:26 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by uburoibob
can someone show me any guitar player that can pull that off at the speed of light (except maybe one or two of the jazz cats in history)?



i'll pop one of my cds in the post for you......[;)]

Arpeggios?  can't get enough of 'em.  i just love the low-high-low  sound.  Eric johnson does them awesomely.  His Venus Isle cd is on repeat play in my car at the moment.  his arpeggios are like a fairy skipping over stepping stones in a quiet river at the end of the garden.  if you know what i mean.......
« Last Edit: September 19, 2006, 11:21:40 AM by David Tomkins »
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #80 on: September 19, 2006, 11:24:21 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by uburoibob
I ask only one request - can someone show me any guitar player that can pull that off at the speed of light (except maybe one or two of the jazz cats in history)?


on a more serious note, is that request not like asking us to sprint slowly?  or am i missing the point slightly?  horses for courses, and you won't find it all in one place.
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline uburoibob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3262
    • Bob Martin 11:11
Essential Solos
« Reply #81 on: September 19, 2006, 08:25:57 PM »
quote:
Originally posted by David Tomkins

quote:
Originally posted by uburoibob
I ask only one request - can someone show me any guitar player that can pull that off at the speed of light (except maybe one or two of the jazz cats in history)?


on a more serious note, is that request not like asking us to sprint slowly?  or am i missing the point slightly?  horses for courses, and you won't find it all in one place.



Hey David,
I was being serious. The things, to me, that go into making something musical are listed in a previous post in this thread. I had a realllly long one, but it got lost in the great hack of 2006. Anyway, a virtuoso is someone like Yehudi Menuhin or Itzak Pearlman (sp?) - someone who can play ANYTHING at light speed. I don't see this in the many of these shredders. To my ear, they are just stringing together exercises in a not-so-musically satisfying way. I know, I know... subjective. And that's OK. I've explained the objective side of it ad nauseum only to be met by vacant stares. You wanna hear some virtuosos playing in an unhearlded way? Listen to the theme from the Jetsons. Think about trying to get a dozen guitar players to play as fast as Eric Johnson all in perfect time, perfect harmony, effortlessly, and not playing scales or arpeggios - having to skip around, alternate pick but in a non-patterned way. Then listen to some Paganini. I dunno. I hear these guys and I am just underwhelmed. High zzzzzz factor. Wake me when we get to the good part.

Bob

2000 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail  *  1999 Parker Fly Deluxe w/DiBurro Roland Mod Metallic Red  * 1998 Fly Classic in Transparent Dark Blue (thanks, Darren!) •  Now on a signature reduction program! Just the Flies, maam. *  www.rtmadvertising.com
1999 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail Butterscotch -   2000 Fly Standard Classic in Cherry Red - http://bobmartin1111.com

Essential Solos

Offline Lwinn171

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1860
Essential Solos
« Reply #82 on: September 19, 2006, 10:51:00 PM »
I'm with you, Bob. I find myself less impressed with speed, for it's own sake. Does it mean something, or is it a parlor trick? I can appreciate both, but as a musician, I'd rather it meant something in a musical sense (which is admittedly hard to define). I define and redefine it to myself as I experience others ideas, as expressed musically. But I find that taste and restraint are things I have always appreciated. A great lead guitarist doesn't leave any doubt as to his or her abilities, but lets you know there is a musicality and tonal mentality behind it.

Lawrence Winn
"42.7 percent of all statistics are made-up on the spot."
2001 Fly Classic, Green
Larivee Parlour Guitar
Several inferior others
Mesa Boogie MK IV
Marshall 2-12 cab

Lawrence Winn
2001 Classic, 98 Deluxe
various amps, various toys

Essential Solos

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #83 on: September 20, 2006, 10:10:20 AM »
Bob - I know you were serious.  when i said 'on a more serious note' it was me that was getting serious, so sorry if i didn't make that clear.  don't feel misunderstood[:)]

I was just saying that i thought it was unfair to ask for all of your (justified) criteria to be in one solo/song/player.  hence the horses for courses reference.
I agree with all your well thought out musicality criteria and we can put that to bed.  i just don't ask for it to all be in one package.  that's why i can stomach yngwie[:D][:D]
perhaps i should listen to some of these Jazz cats.[8D]  it's been a while since a guitarist has popped my socks off (metaphorically)  i like that robert conti guy.
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline uburoibob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3262
    • Bob Martin 11:11
Essential Solos
« Reply #84 on: September 20, 2006, 12:06:41 PM »
Sorry, I didn't mean to get all serious on everybody!

Bob

2000 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail  *  1999 Parker Fly Deluxe w/DiBurro Roland Mod Metallic Red  * 1998 Fly Classic in Transparent Dark Blue (thanks, Darren!) •  Now on a signature reduction program! Just the Flies, maam. *  www.rtmadvertising.com
1999 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail Butterscotch -   2000 Fly Standard Classic in Cherry Red - http://bobmartin1111.com

Essential Solos

Offline David Tomkins

  • Advanced Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1718
Essential Solos
« Reply #85 on: September 22, 2006, 02:09:15 AM »
anyway, the solo in Boston's More than a feeling is rather good.  one of the guitar mags once suggested it sounds like it ould be the natioal anthem for a small european country!
2005 Green Quilted Maple Custom Mojo signed by Steve Vai, 2006 Parker Fly T-Shirt, 2006 Parker Fly Baseball Cap.  A triple-whammy of Parker goodness!!

Essential Solos

Offline uburoibob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3262
    • Bob Martin 11:11
Essential Solos
« Reply #86 on: September 22, 2006, 10:59:00 AM »
quote:
Originally posted by David Tomkins

anyway, the solo in Boston's More than a feeling is rather good.  one of the guitar mags once suggested it sounds like it ould be the natioal anthem for a small european country!



LOL! I know exactly what they mean! I remember that solo ALMOST supplanted Stairway To Heaven as the most played thing when trying out guitars in 1976/77 in the store where I worked. Pairs of guitarists would come in and show off their joint chops.

Bob

2000 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail  *  1999 Parker Fly Deluxe w/DiBurro Roland Mod Metallic Red  * 1998 Fly Classic in Transparent Dark Blue (thanks, Darren!) •  Now on a signature reduction program! Just the Flies, maam. *  www.rtmadvertising.com
1999 Parker Fly Artist Custom Hardtail Butterscotch -   2000 Fly Standard Classic in Cherry Red - http://bobmartin1111.com