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Author Topic: Single Cut Dynamics  (Read 2463 times)

Offline 908ssp

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« on: September 01, 2008, 02:33:10 PM »
I can't help but think about this and I have an idea. Maybe they are going to give the SC a real carved maple top.[:0] That would be terrific and would add to the mojo and lp-ness of the SC. Man if it had a 24.625 scale and a carved maple top I'd finally have to buy a new Parker. I want mine faded light cherry burst on a flamed top.



Alex

« Last Edit: September 01, 2008, 09:24:17 PM by 908ssp »
Alex

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Offline tildeslash

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« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2008, 02:46:40 PM »
I've been screaming for a Gibson Scale SC ever since they introduced the SC.
Nobody is listening to me.
 

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Offline jamrcat

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« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2008, 04:03:33 PM »
Pulkit, it's not that nobody is listening, It's just that those who are listening can't do anything about it! [:D] A faded light cherry burst on a flamed top! Put me on that list! [;)]

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Offline Strandwolf

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« Reply #3 on: September 30, 2008, 07:18:09 PM »
quote:
Originally posted by tildeslash

I've been screaming for a Gibson Scale SC ever since they introduced the SC.
Nobody is listening to me.



I'm finally gonna bite on this (instead of silently researching the archive to find the answers):

The difference in string length would be, uh, about 5%, right? The string tension would be slightly less then, right? This would make the strings slightly easier to push/pull/bend, then.... Also, what effect would there be, if any, on tone and sustain, etc.?

Jim (lazy but curious)
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Offline bno

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« Reply #4 on: September 30, 2008, 07:30:21 PM »
I'm thinking that the technical engineering issues required to rescale the neck are not insignificant.  That being said I think the ROI on doing it and making the SC to the shorter LP scale would be a reasonable pursuit.  I wonder if the shorter scale and the string tension are part of the LP sound that some forum members pursue with such zeal...
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Offline 908ssp

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« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2008, 09:51:28 PM »
I understand from my reading that changing the scale of the instrument does influence the sound particularly the over tones and harmonics. That the shorter scale has a stronger fundamental tone relative to the harmonic tones. While all of the feel issues you have pointed out are true there is also difference in the tone as well.

I think that Parker is more likely to follow the lead of the traditional LP in making the new single cut than go off on their own and innovate. Not sure that is the best course but I certainly think it is likely to produce the most sales over the shortest period of time.

I would be very interested in buying a short scale SC with a real maple top and mahogany body and neck. Keep the weight in the neighborhood of 6 lbs and I think they would have a real winner.[^]

Alex

Alex

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Offline bluffalo

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« Reply #6 on: October 01, 2008, 01:17:33 AM »
I dont understand why people want a guitar to be LIKE a Gibson, or a fender. why is everything compared to these two? out of my 4 guitars, i dont know the neck shape, the size, the radius, the net width, etc etc etc etc. i just play them. they sound nice. they look nice.

obviously there has to be some similarity for someone to pick up a guitar and think "yep this is a guitar, i know how to play one of these things", but why can't each guitar be a bit unique? why does it matter? isnt the point of owning more than one guitar to have more than one guitar?

unless it is flat out trying to be a copy of something, then i can understand that it might matter if details are different....
 

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Offline Paul Marossy

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« Reply #7 on: October 01, 2008, 09:03:48 AM »
quote:
I dont understand why people want a guitar to be LIKE a Gibson, or a fender. why is everything compared to these two?



Well, the Strat and the Les Paul are kind of the standard by which just about every electric guitar is judged by. The different scale lengths have a different feel to them when you are playing the guitar, and they do also sound a bit different from eachother, too. What a difference 3/4" makes, eh?

http://www.electric-guitar-review.com/2006/07/12/your-guitars-scale-length-a-primer/

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« Last Edit: October 01, 2008, 09:05:07 AM by Paul Marossy »

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Offline tildeslash

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« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2008, 09:18:00 AM »
LesPaul does have a great sound and many won't deny that.
SO it would be nice to see what a Parker would sound like that is Short Scale.
Not the same sure but maybe close enough with all the advantage of the Parker.
My God - try playing above the 15th fret on a LesPaul.
No I am not just harping about the upper fret accessibility but imagine a great playing guitar with SS fret and short scale on top of that.  Would it be even more effortless?  

I mean a short scale guitar usually has provided a better or ease of playability over a Fender scale and many have made this observation.  Therefore this would translate to a Parker 10 folds.

Also remember - A Nitefly has basic dimensions of a Fender Strat yet even with Fender pickups -  it does not sound like a Fender - close enough with all the advantages of a Parker.  Therefore - a Short Scale Single Cut should be a next logical step in Parker making one.  

How about a forum only Short Scale Singlecut - I'll take one and if you get enough and you make them then you can  market them to the public.  Atleast the forumites will have the first batch which will be valuable in the future - a great history behind it and just a darn cool idea that a new Parker came about from a bunch of forumites wanting one.

Let's do it.
 

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Offline Strandwolf

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« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2008, 01:28:38 PM »
quote:
Originally posted by tildeslash

How about a forum only Short Scale Singlecut - I'll take one and if you get enough and you make them then you can  market them to the public.  Atleast the forumites will have the first batch which will be valuable in the future - a great history behind it and just a darn cool idea that a new Parker came about from a bunch of forumites wanting one.

Let's do it.



I won't admit to be totally fired up as I'm still not satisfied that a so-called short scale leads to nirvana (not the group) that some seem to crave here. Nonetheless, were a limited edition of such be offered I would spring for it, after I get a Concert, an Artist, and a Deluxe, oh, and a refined Nylon.

Now how about a long scale, say 28 inch?
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Offline Paul Marossy

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« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2008, 01:33:38 PM »
quote:
Now how about a long scale, say 28 inch?


Hmm... a Baritone Fly?! That could be interesting. [:0]

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Offline Strandwolf

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« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2008, 05:15:39 PM »
Source: Wikipedia-

Baritone guitars have larger bodies than standard guitars, especially in the case of acoustic instruments, and have longer scale lengths which allow the strings to be tuned lower while remaining close to or at normal tension. On a standard, steel-string, acoustic guitar, the scale length (the distance from the nut or string guide to the saddle on the bridge) is typically 24.9" to 25.7", and the strings range in diameter from .012" to .054". The scale lengths of various baritone designs range from 27" to 30.5", and the string gauges range from the normal .012 - .054" set to sets as thick as .017 - .095". Shorter-scale baritone guitars are more like long-scale guitars, having more midrange volume, whereas the longer scale lengths and heavier string sets give more bass to the instrument's timbre. Shorter scale baritones tend to be tuned C-C or B-B whereas longer ones are typically tuned A-A.

Duane Eddy

The Danelectro baritone was used by million-selling guitarist Duane Eddy on some of his huge hits, such as "Bonnie Came Back," "Because They're Young," "Kommotion," (all 1960), "My Blue Heaven"(1961), "Deep in the Heart of Texas" (1962), and "The Son of Rebel Rouser" (1964). The instrument was used almost exclusively on his best-selling album "The Twang's The Thang" (Jamie Records, 1960) and pops up regularly on singles and albums throughout his career (for instance, "Twang Thang," The Duane Eddy Anthology, Rhino Records).

The "twangy" sound of his guitars (which include Duane Eddy custom-builts by Guild, Grestch and Gibson) augmented the even deeper twangy sound made by the Danelectro baritone.

Electric guitars, including the Stratocaster, Telecaster, Esquire, and Jazzmaster use a scale length of 25.5 in (65 cm). A few Fender models such as the Jaguar use a scale length of 24 in (61 cm). Fender has also built some 3/4-size student guitars with a scale length of 22.5 in (57 cm) or shorter.

Gibson uses a scale length of 24.75 in (63 cm) on many of its electric guitars, including the Les Paul, Flying V, Explorer, SG, and ES-335. Gibson has used other scale lengths on various models through the years.

    * 24.75 in (629 mm):
          o Gibson Les Paul
          o Gibson SG
          o Original Gibson ES-150
          o Fender Cyclone
          o Rickenbacker most electric guitars (including 330, 340, 350, 360, 370, 380, 620, 650, 660)

    * 25 in (635 mm)
          o Most Paul Reed Smith guitars

    * 25.5 in (648 mm), closest to the classical guitar scale:
          o Fender Esquire
          o Fender Telecaster
          o Fender Stratocaster
          o Fender Jazzmaster
          o Most Jackson Guitars
          o Squier Stratocaster
          o Most and current Gibson ES-150
          o Most Ibanez guitars

From www.12fret.com

    A guitar's scale length is the distance between the bone nut or zero fret and the bridge's saddle. This measurement not only determines the placement of the frets for proper intonation, but has a profound effect on string tension, tone, and in some cases, tuning stability.

     The physics is fairly easy to grasp. If two guitars of different scale lengths (i.e. Fender and Gibson guitars) are strung with equal gauge strings and tuned to normal concert pitch, the shorter scale Gibson will have less tension , resulting in a "looser" feel. You can prove this to yourself by capoing any guitar at the first fret (effectively shorting the scale length) and then retuning down to concert pitch. The strings will now be under less tension, making them easier to bend and vibrato. You may also notice that the instrument now has more "buzzing" and "fret rattle" when played, because of the increased vibrating amplitude of the looser strings.

      While some electric guitarists use a shorter scale instrument to achieve less string tension and easier playability, others see it as an opportunity to get a "thicker" tone utilizing heavier gauge strings. For instance, take two identical electric guitar bodies, one fitted with a 25 1/2", and the other with a 24 3/4" scale neck. If you find your technique requires using .009 - .042 gauge strings on the longscale, you'll probably get the same feel utilizing a heavier .010 - .046 gauge on the short scale instrument, The heavier gauge strings will also have the side-effect of inducing more voltage in your pickups, resulting in a "thicker" fundamental note, and more output.

        Scale length also has sonic implications connected with acoustic instruments. A shorter scale acoustic guitar often produces a "woody" tone with an overall warm timbre, while a longer scale is perceived as having more power overall, with increased clarity and distinction in the bass registers. Both sounds are valid, and historically it is not without precedent for a manufacturer to issue two models of guitars whose main difference is scale length (i.e. Martin's 000 and OM models) or offer the same model with long or short scale as an option (Ramirez concert classicals).

        I'll leave you with a few examples showing the array of scale lengths utilized in popular guitars.
 
FENDER    .             GIBSON    .
Duosonic    22 1/2"             Byrdland    23 1/2"
Jaguar    24"             Les Paul    24 3/4"
Strat/Tele    25 1/2"             Johnny Smith    25"
Jazz Bass    34"             Country Gent    25 1/2"
 

 
 



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Offline Paul Marossy

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« Reply #12 on: October 01, 2008, 05:18:04 PM »
Huh, the PRS scale length is right in between a Fender and a Gibson. I didn't know that. Interesting...

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Offline bno

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« Reply #13 on: October 01, 2008, 07:28:35 PM »
Which makes those big a$$ strings on SRV's Strat all the more intriguing.  {Edit: Per Bill's response below - I'm not an SRV expert but the lore of his using rediculously heavy strings for his style of playing is known).
« Last Edit: October 01, 2008, 09:39:48 PM by bno »
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Offline Bill

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« Reply #14 on: October 01, 2008, 09:08:15 PM »
Didn't he often drop down to E flat ?

That would help with the tension a little.

(I'm not even close to being familiar with SRV. I just started paying attention to him myself. I was drooling over his utube performances and I started playing the base line along with him for " Excited" and noticed I think he was droped down a half step).

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« Last Edit: October 01, 2008, 10:29:01 PM by Bill »
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